I counted at least 20 units for sale. Some for almost a year and a half. With $1200.00 a month in HOA’s and empty units this place must be really hurting. I pass by there at night and it still looks like a ghost town.

Look this up:  It has info on Marquee, Watermark, Irvine PLaze and others.  Still a little too pricey (which explains so many vacant units).
www.kagill.com
 41 units for sales in the Marquee vs 18 who closed in 2007…that’s a pretty bad ratio.

We locals call them the “North Korea” towers.  Kind of like how North Korea looks from space at night.
There are no lights on ever. The Marquee is a perfect example of an Orange County high rise and its inability to attract
buyers. The exciting views of the old Fluor building or the 405 just are not worth a Million Bucks for a 2 bedroom 2 bath with a nice balcony. Neither is the “large” 1350 Sq. Foot design.  LOL.  The top penthouse unit facing the sea I can maybe understand for some high roller. But still thats like $ 2 mil. No Garage. And as far as anything in walking distance. Your going to burn out on Houstons and CPK real quick.  I wonder how Lennar is going to sit on the Astoria Towers its building. Last I heard the High Rise was going to open in Aug 2008. They are still working on the rest of the Central Park West buildings but last I heard not selling them yet.  I just dont get the appeal of a High Rise next to the 405 ???

No_Vas

Great visual!!!

Enjoy!

I am sure those early buyers who used to have a view are happy wht that office behmoth that went up in their face. How could anyone want to live there for and pay that 1200 HOA.  Sucker born every day I guess

Anyone know what school district these are actually in? Half the listings I see say Irvine, other half say Santa Ana. Obviously a huge difference there.

Type in an exact address here to get the assigned schools (assuming it’s in Irvine)
http://iusd.org/asp-bin/whichschool/

I bought one and flipped it just before they announced the HOA’s.  Thank god, I managed to make a few dollars though and let some other knife catcher grab ahold.  Anyways good luck and don’t work too hard.
-bix

I remember that they were saying that over a third of these units are owned by "investors". Holding a high end unit with a huge mortgage and HOA empty for so long has got to hurt. Have we seen ANY REO activity in this block?

Thanks Anonymous. I tried an address from Marquee Place and it didn’t show up - suggesting it’s not in IUSD, which means they are then in Santa Ana Unified (gulp). That means a bunch of listing agents are either clueless or are lying about the school district.

I can’t believe the staying power of the flippers/bagholders/speculators in these towers as well as the Plaza Irvine towers.  I don’t see any reduction in pricing despite the huge inventory with most of them probably over a year on the market.  I’d really like to see IHB blog these high rises one of these days (if IHB did it in the last 2 weeks I apologize in advance because I was away on vacation).  I would have thought the alligators (HOAs and mortgage costs) must have eaten most of the owners by now, but maybe the owners are tougher than most?

I would like to write an entry on these towers again, but I have difficulty finding good property data.

wait, does anybody know why the HOA’s fee is 1.2K??? it’s not like they have a lawn or flowers in those towers. Does it include utilities?

I’m thinking they rolled the Mello-Roos into it….   otherwise, it’s ridiculous.

The HOA’s do cover alot of fluff: workout gym, pool, concierge service, valet parking and other bs. They also cover some utilities like cable and insurance but they are nowhere near $1200 in value.  I too have been amazed at the staying power of this group of FBs.  Since most of the speculators were RE agents I imagine the financial ability to hold out has to collapse soon. Who will blink first will be fun to watch

In the last condo I owned, the fees included all of the above with the exception of valet.  We had 24 hour front doorman/security (would accept your packages, announce your guests, etc), basic cable and EQ insurance included in the fee.  Average was 700 bucks a month for a two bedroom.   So the valet costs everyone 500 a month ?  Hmm.  I still think they rolled the Mello Roos into the condo fees….so on the surface it will appear as if you don’t have to pay them.  ( " Sure it’s 1200 a month, but just think !  There’s no Mello-Roos in this building "!)
Another thought is 1200 is temporary, perhaps to build up their reserves ?  Other than that, it’s a rip.  I lived in a luxury building…     <a href=“http://www.downtownluxuryliving.com/index.php?c>Long Beach Real Estate | Downtown Luxury Living</a>   700 is adequate for high end fees. 

that is how feel too, if Mello-Roos are not included, what a rip-off! When I was looking at some Leisure World high rise units for my in-laws, the fee was 1K per month (but that included 2 meals & a maid service, even though it is still a lot for those tiny studios and 1bed places).
i guess the builder was targeting high-income professionals who just need a place to spend the night when they work late and who don’t care about 14K a year down the drain and who live elsewhere. Still, even wealthy professionals don’t waste their money like that. Strange. Oh, and HOA fees never go down!

On a cashflow basis to a landlord looking to make a monthly profit from rental income, the condos in this tower are worth about $100,000. I am not kidding. Because the fees are so high, the breakeven for an owner occupant is probably between $160,000 and $200,000. When these units start becoming REOs, the carnage will be breathtaking…

HOA fees will go down if the whole thing is REOs.
Banks don’t like to pay fees.  I was standing in line after having a final summary judgt set aside in a foreclosure.  Henh, heh.  the atty in front of me was a HOA atty.  Said the banks didn’t pay, they would foreclose, bank would pay (including atty fees), then the whole thing would start over again.  Too few employees. 
This can’t possibly be cost effective. 
But, after the Banks are in control of the assn, because they own a majority of the units, what will they do?  Will they be smart enuf to take control?  If you’ve read anything I wrote before, the answer is no, and the reason is—they are stupid.

the intersection of jamboree and campus has been around for a long time, there would be no mello roos associated with longstanding infrastructure, right?  so the $1,200/month HOA seems awfully high assuming there is no mello roos component.  well, no one said feeding an alligator was cheap!

If I remember correctly, the high HOAs were due to the concierge services and amenties which were supposed to be much better than even a 5-star hotel.
By the way, I don’t think the actual product sucks and would actually love to live in such a high rise.  The biggest downfall for Marquee is its location and lack of restaurants and shopping to walk to.  And obviously the pricing is rediculous.  Also, for those wondering why someone would enjoy a high rise, I think its the draw to living in a hotel like environment.  Its not for everyone but I spent 3 months in Hong Kong in a high rise and absolutely loved it.  

I don’t remember if it’s at the Marquee Place. Unless, it’s at another luxury high rise but the HOAs include a 24 hour doctor on call.

A free doctor ?   LOL   Sure, he/she might be on call in the building, but you’d still have to pay a bill….   I do recall NIR mentioning this some time ago.
Anywho…fumbling, you might be right about no Mello…. 

Higher end places in Long Beach are charging $6-900 a month so $1200 here sounds about right. Any way you cut it I would not want that extra expense every month regardless of the concierge. That guy would practically have to chew my food at each meal to justify his pay.

Okay, lets take a look at $1200 bucks, and what it gets you…

$1200

-$40 gym membership.

-$200 concierge service. (There is an internet/phone service, that I looked into and too lazy to get the link, that would be able to deliver the amount of service most people would need.)

-$35 for wine storage. (I can’t recall if Marquee offers this, but most do.)

-$30 for the parties hosted in the lounge. (Seriously, how much would you use this? Legendcellars offers this, and the monthly cost I used seems high.)

-$50 valet. (Think about it! 300 units, $50 a month, equals $15k a month, and that is one hell of a high paid valet.)

Total HOA = $845. For what? So, they can wax the elevator doors? When they would probably screw it up, and put nasty streaks in it, just like Fletcher Jones does to cars. For that amount of money, my windows better be so clean, people would feel like they would fall out, because they can’t tell if they exist. I would need Chinese laundry service. (For those who have not lived in SF or NYC, this is not a racial thing, this is what is called.) I would expect a well known chef in the building. I mean, the hi-rise builders get it in SF and have them. Seriously, could you imagine what room service from Michael Mina or Gary Danko would be like? I would be willing to pay for that. Most importantly, I would need a massage with a happy ending once a week, and with so few people living there, I would expect two for one specials every month.

There is a place for rent, in the 3131 building, on the 13th floor, 1538 sqft., for $3300 a month. It is also for sale for $995k. Even if you do bullish math, it would not even make sense if you freebased the kool-aid to buy it.

I have said this before, and I am saying it again: Hi-rise/high density is an affordability product, and only when there is no more buildable land. Despite the bulls argument, there is plenty of land, and there is no real need for his product, at least not yet. But, there is absolutely no reason for a premium, when 60% of Marquee was non-owner occupied for this product. With all the units behind on their property taxes, I expect to see one of these at a REDC auction soon. Like ISM said, this isn’t the product we want, and there is a deference between supply side and demand side. It’s too bad the builders are just repeating what they did in the 90s.