Urgency Versus Reality: realtors Win, Buyers Lose

Jan 26th, 2010  
by IrvineRenter  in Short Sale

Astute Observations

Astute Observation by IrvineRenter
2010-01-25 09:32 PM

When reading the comments today, see if you detect the faint cries of realtors with a small “r.”

Astute Observation by AZDavidPhx
2010-01-26 08:31 AM

You know - I have occasionally wandered over to some used house peddler’s active rain blog and made perfectly reasoned arguments only to watch them get deleted by the administrator within a half hour of posting.

I never see anybody showing up here claiming that you have deleted their observations.  Over the weekend there was some trolling that was clearly off-topic and personal which was not censored either.

It’s actually a good thing.  The blog serves as a check; if anyone felt they were swindled by your business then they could always come on over here and let us all know about it.  Since you do not pre-screen comments on here - I think it adds quite a bit of credibility.

I would be really glad to see the real-estate industry move to an informative open format like that and do away with all of the deception and hustling that attracts some of society’s less prestigious elements.

The word realtor is now just another dirty word, disgraced by a corrupt lobbying group and propaganda machine.  I don’t doubt that there are some good people out there but they need to repent and disassociate themselves from the turdherd.

Astute Observation by Walter
2010-01-26 11:03 AM

You could try, but you will have a problem showing many properties because the Supra key system is controlled by the associations of Realtors.

I would prefer not to be a Realtor, but joined for this reason alone.

Astute Observation by matt138
2010-01-27 02:40 PM

I’d like to see the people break that stronghold.  Good luck.

I see a need for a new, competing designation. 

People do prefer to be told the truth.  Besides, of what benefit to friends, family, clients, and society is advising everyone to go broke?

Astute Observation by Chris
2010-01-26 06:12 AM

OT For those that are predicting a USD doom, check this out:

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/Dollar-mixed-against-cnnm-1171037887.html?x=0&.v=1

Traders also flocked to the yen for safety after credit rating agency Standard & Poor’s downgraded Japan’s debt to “negative” from “stable.”

Astute Observation by awgee
2010-01-26 09:29 AM

Looking for the soundness of a currency by comparing it against other currencies is analogous to comparing the health of a room full on heroin junkies and declaring one to be healthier than the rest, therefore that one is healthy.

Astute Observation by lowrydr310
2010-01-26 06:54 AM

I got a good chuckle this morning when I read an AP article that highlighted government spending and debt.

Look at that last line about gold assets, and see how it compares to all the other numbers!

Astute Observation by Making Homes Cost More Programs
2010-01-26 07:34 AM

“If a buyer is looking at a $400,000 home, very low interest rates make the payment affordable, but when interest rates go up, it will be harder and harder to finance that $400,000 home. In fact, if interest rates go up a full point, a buyer might lose as much as $100,000 in buying power; therefore, you should buy before interest rates go up.”

This obviously isn’t true, but what is true is that home prices will be very sticky with interest rates rising.  If interest rates jump 1% today, home prices don’t immediately drop 10%, in fact they may never.  It depends on other factors in the economy.  Typically if interest rates go up it means the economy is heating up. 

Given the current environment if interest rates go up, the economy will quickly head back into recession which will lead to lower interest rates.  MBS will be purchased by the government until the bad debt is off bank balance sheets, you can forget any BS deadline.  This is what is needed to come remotely close to justifying higher interest rates in the economy. 

If we see another huge crash in the stock market, or unemployment heading considerably higher we will see 4% mortgage rates.

Astute Observation by Making Homes Cost More Programs
2010-01-26 07:39 AM

I should qualify that in less desirable areas prices may be far less sticky.  In areas like Irvine prices will be very inelastic with interest rates, due to the relationship interest rates have with the economy and those with cash reserves.

Astute Observation by AZDavidPhx
2010-01-26 08:52 AM

Prices will not immediately drop because most sellers are oblivious to the current market conditions.  Rising interest rates mean nothing to them - they are looking at what the house would have sold for in 2006.

The realtors will start suggesting that the price be lowered but depending on how stubborn and arrogant the seller is, it will just sit there on the market wasting everybody’s time.

Sellers can keep whining all they want - but from what I am seeing, those that drop their price under the comps by a significant amount not just some 5K window dressing, find their buyer very quickly.

The problem is all the misinformation being given to sellers by the media.  Daily calls of prices bottoming, median prices rising, sales increasing, etc.  It’s giving sellers false hope which leads to more unwillingness to drop their fantasy price. 

So we all just sit in a quagmire waiting.

Astute Observation by alles_klar
2010-01-26 11:51 AM

MCHCMP, I respectfully disagree. 

I think your analysis of interest rates is way over simplified.  As long as there is a heavy appetite for U.S. debt, then yes, I think you may be correct.  But if buyers of our debt, like China and the petrol states, decide to stop or significantly slow down buying our debt, then the Fed will be reluctant to buy further MBS.  That is one example.  There are also other instances in which the Fed would be prevented and/or reluctant to continuing buying MBS.

Also, I am not sure about your sticky argument either.  I’ve been watching a lot of very desirable Jumbo loan markets crashing relatively quickly due to the Jumbo loan market not being supported by the Fed/Treasury.  I fail to see why the same would not happen if the Fed/Treasury stopped or reduced its support of the conforming loan market.

Astute Observation by matt138
2010-01-27 02:53 PM

It is futile to fight free market forces forever.  Interest rates will rise no matter what our gov/t & fed do.

They are buying time and in doing so, will cause rates to rise even higher.

The gov/t can only manipulate rates so much.  Free market forces win every time.

Astute Observation by norcal
2010-01-26 03:33 PM

Let’s see how Irvine does by the end of this year - or better yet, end of 2012, when the second Option ARM wave of recasts hits.  According to Dr. Housing Bubble, the foreclosures and shadow inventory now on the market is low-hanging fruit, compared to what’s coming.

Astute Observation by lowrydr310
2010-01-26 09:07 AM

“So we all just sit in a quagmire waiting.”

Giggidy!

Astute Observation by awgee
2010-01-26 09:37 AM

IR - I want to get this straight.  There exists seminars to teach agents how to create urgency to buy in their clients?  The goal of the seminar is not framed in that context, is it?  What is the theme of the seminar?  How to increase your sales?  I now this will sound extremely naive, but does anybody in the seminar ask why it would be necessary or desirable to create urgency rather than prudence?  It is not a rhetorical question.  I really want to know.

Astute Observation by Walter
2010-01-26 12:35 PM

If you have ever works in sales: cars, computers, houses, mortgages, etc., etc. you will find “how to sell more” classes.

They will will have names like “Have your best year ever with my amazing class”, but they are basically techniques for selling classes. The quality/value of the product is not the focus of these classes.

Astute Observation by awgee
2010-01-26 01:35 PM

I have never worked in sales.

Astute Observation by Walter
2010-01-26 01:50 PM

Well I will some it up this way:

These classes remind me of watching the movie Boiler Room - http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0181984/

Astute Observation by DoomsdayRichard
2010-01-26 09:59 AM

I have a question: What is a Notice of Rescission and do you have any ideas as to why they were issued on this property?

Astute Observation by IrvineRenter
2010-01-26 10:15 AM

A Notice of Rescission is the legal document recorded when a lender is satisfied the loan is current. It erases a Notice of Default and a Notice of Trustee Sale and thereby restarts all statutory clocks. They are most common after a loan modification.

Astute Observation by wheresthebeef
2010-01-26 10:02 AM

The owner of the featured house has not made a payment since 2007…that makes my blood boil!  Get those good for nothing deadbeats out of that house asap and sell it to someone who can make the payments. 

These people literally robbed the bank for almost half a million dollars and will get off with a less than stellar credit score.  How is this fair?  I demand debtor’s prison be reinstated!

Astute Observation by sure
2010-01-26 10:27 AM

I have heard a story that a short sell house actually goes to a relative of house owner and the owner does not need to move out the house.
So essentially everything is the same, the only difference is the owner gets principal reduction and a couple of months free rent.

Astute Observation by stillwaiting
2010-01-26 12:32 PM

Yeah, it happened to someone I know,and the guy said what the heck, you messed up your HELOC and ask me to the rescue (and asked him to put $75000 downpayment). he so pissed off.

Astute Observation by Yummyhatorade
2010-01-26 11:10 AM

It is a lie that they didn’t pay since 2007.  And the lender will be out a few thousand - at most.  They owe less than $600k.

This house appreciated - it’s a simple concept, but one that shall not be uttered here.

Astute Observation by wheresthebeef
2010-01-26 11:59 AM

Oh wise one…where do you get your info from?  We should compare sources so see who is right and who is wrong.

Astute Observation by IrvineRenter
2010-01-26 10:13 AM

Everyone, the realtor from yesterday posted on the blog!

I am leaving him the last word, but you can engage him if you wish:

Rebuttal from John Mulkey

Astute Observation by HomeBeggar
2010-01-26 12:22 PM

While I like John’s blog a bit too, I have to side with IrvineRenter on this issue.

Astute Observation by AZDavidPhx
2010-01-26 02:00 PM

I like how he calls himself a free market conservative yet his entire thesis was in calling for a hard core Socialist intervention on behalf of the rest of us.  John doesn’t like the free market when his own equity or job on the line.

Astute Observation by Anthony
2010-01-26 02:35 PM

Aren’t they all the same.
Look at the McCains (Cindy), Chenneys, and that San Diego Mayor on the gay and same sex marriage.
They are all for it now and are sympathetic to the movement because they are directly in it, have an interest in it.
“Don’t do what I preach; Just do what I do.”
grin

Astute Observation by mike in irvine
2010-01-26 10:17 AM

This house has been on the market for more than a year. I saw it last year, it is was dump, it will need a lot of money to fix the mess. The house is rented out. It is amazing how people are able to game the system… If someone in an IAC appartment does not pay rent for a month or two, their ass would be in the parking lot in a matter of days.

Astute Observation by Soylent Green Is People
2010-01-26 12:50 PM

I can’t say this was my quip, but from the Redfin forums I read:

“I wouldn’t want to invest in a home, but I might buy one to live in”.

IMHO, a great, one sentence summary of how people should look at buying a house today.

Homedebtors have been convinced that when you buy a house you are “investing”. I beg to differ. Investing assumes a manageable return with some measure of liquidity. Neither of these features are guaranteed when you buy real estate.

I’d like to see realtors (small “r”) compelled someday to ask two questions of their clients before “putting them in the car to look at houses”

1) What do you see the benefit of buying is now?

2) Did you know the new house you want has a payment nearly twice the amount of a similar home in the area that is for rent?

I won’t hold my breath for that day to come.

My .02c

Soylent Green Is People.

Astute Observation by wheresthebeef
2010-01-26 01:27 PM

SGIP,

Excellent point.  The likelihood of a Realtor (TM) asking those questions is the same day a car salesman says, “that 5 yr old Accord you drove in looks and runs great, why would you want to trade it in for a new one.”  The real estate industrial complex will be a tough nut to crack.  They are a very powerful organization peddling to mostly uneducated (when it comes to viewing the big real estate picture) buyers. 

I would love to own a house of my own, but not at the insane mark up compared to renting.

Astute Observation by curious
2010-01-26 02:57 PM

A question on the loan modification process.  Hoping the experts here can shed some light on how this makes sense from the financial side.  I have tried to figure this out, but cannot for the life of me.  Have seen all the docs and know the numbers are true.

A co-worker bought eight years ago, paid $370,000.  2 refis later, balance was up to $640,000.  Mortgage was at about $2400 then, but 5 years later reset to around $3300.  Of course, that was too much and about 9 months went by without a mortgage payment.  The loan modification process began and a couple months ago a trial modification began with a payment of $1760.

How can the lending company (GMAC) stay in business?  Could the modifcation process involve a 40 or 50 or 99 year mortgage to keep the payment that low?

Astute Observation by newbie2008
2010-01-26 06:02 PM

Making loan modification work? 
Simple
1.  Lower the principle for the “home owner,” i.e. debtor and lower the interest rate.
2.  Govt to give the banks $30000 to $50000 upfront for the principle reduction and have the govt. also give a reoccuring 1.5% interest subsidy.
3.  Govt assumes liability of the loan if it goes bad.  If loans are good, the bank makes a huge profit, if the loan goes bad, banks breaks even to a middle size profit.
4.  Debtor no longer can pay (as in most of the modifications after a year), but would be better if delay until after the elections.
5.  Bank FC and Taxpayers are made to pay for the FC cost, loan servicing, deliquent payments, and other bank fees.  Liability of the remainer is transfer to the govt and then the taxpayers are forced to pay.
6.  Banks made more than whole. 
Program is a huge success.

BWB, BHO, TG, Berne and WS are leaping with joy on the sucessful loan modification program.

Astute Observation by Newbie2008
2010-01-26 05:45 PM

“Does this make my butt look fat?”

Why of course not. 
It looks fat regardless of what you’re wearing.

Astute Observation by zubs
2010-01-26 06:34 PM

No, your fat makes you look fat.

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