Banks expected to get off easy in settlement of foreclosure practices

Nov 9th, 2011  
by IrvineRenter  in Library News

Astute Observations

Astute Observation by SanJoseRenter
2011-11-09 07:34 AM

> The main thing which kept me from buying during the housing bubble was a recognition of the fact I couldn’t afford a property equivalent to what I could rent ...

This “financial pro” is your mirror opposite:

NYT: How a financial pro lost his house

He bought into every cliche that we speculate on.

Astute Observation by IrvineRenter
2011-11-09 09:04 AM

Thanks, I will use that article next week.

Astute Observation by Leviathan
2011-11-09 09:18 AM

Yes, I just read that piece and was hoping it would make the rounds today.  I give the guy credit for coming clean on his egregious mistakes, and his empathy for people who made similar ones.  But I can’t figure out why anyone would ever trust their money to his care again after reading this, nor would I buy a book by him.

As for the crap settlement discussed in this blog posting, I have a suggestion for how to distribute the money.  Let every qualified loan owner submit a bid.  How much do I need in relief to keep my house?  Why do I deserve x amount in principal reduction?  What would I do with the extra money?

Submit the bids to the banks and to an impartial panel of experts, say one assembled by the folks at Propublica.  I don’t really want the government involved because what is being granted here is government/legal absolution, so they are not at all impartial.  Plus, the government and the banks have, collectively, been botching the housing “rescue” for at least three years now.  My dog could do a better job.

At the end of the day, we’d shine a spotlight on the real plight of millions, (maybe) force the banks to give relief to the most worthy, and demonstrate how utterly inadequate these attempts are once and for all.

End extend and pretend.  It’s the only way out.

Astute Observation by Perspective
2011-11-09 09:57 AM

My bid wouldn’t include any crying or pleading for “relief.”  It would very simply state the dire position my creditor is in, without claiming any personal financial hardship.  My bid would demand a rate reduction, but no principal reduction.  It would clearly state the risk currently on their books, and how that risk could be greatly mitigated.  I would even offer to pay-down principal in exchange for the rate reduction.

Is that “worthy”?

Astute Observation by Leviathan
2011-11-09 10:14 AM

Hey man, I didn’t lay out the game board, don’t come after me.  I’m just suggesting an alternate set of rules to the current ones in which most money moves between government and banks, bypassing the rest of us.

For the record, I have no skin in the game (anymore) and stand to get a whopping $1500 from BofA, which should have given me a rate reduction two years ago when I asked for it, then they might not be in the predicament they are currently in. 

See, I can play by your rules too.  But I suspect BofA’s problems extend beyond me, and perhaps you.

Then again, they have the backing of the Fed behind them, and I don’t suppose anything really bad will happen to them as the game is designed to benefit them.  See how that works?

So, where were we?  Oh yeah, Barry already has your refi in his back pocket.  Your problems are solved.

Astute Observation by Perspective
2011-11-09 11:13 AM

I wasn’t coming after you - just posing a question. In politics today, it seems every day we’re talking about what is “fair” and who “deserves” what or is “worthy” of what.

I don’t deserve anything from my creditor.  I knew full well what I was getting into.  I have perfectly reasonable and fair options available to me.  I have a purhcase mortgage on owner-occupied residential real estate in California.  I can stop paying and live rent-free for 6+ months and then move, without my creditor coming after me for any deficiency.  That’s fair.

I would love to pay-down my mortgage 5%-10% today in exchange for lowering my rate to 4%-5%.  That’s a fair deal for both parties.  We’ll see if the AGs’ settlement results in these types of deals…

Astute Observation by Leviathan
2011-11-09 11:50 AM

Sounds reasonable and fair to me as well.  That makes it all the more unlikely in the world we currently inhabit.  But I’ll keep my fingers crossed for you anyway.

Astute Observation by Perspective
2011-11-09 01:23 PM

While this story is much better than most other human interest foreclosure stories, it’s still missing too much info.  In order to provide a complete picture, we need to know his financials when he bought the house, when he HELOC’d the house, and when he sold it short.  How else do I know if he bought a house he couldn’t afford?  It’s a safe assumption, but why not provide the entire story?

e.g. He bought a $575K house.  If his household had no other debt and their income was ~$200K, then that’s not unreasonable.  If their income was less than $100K and they had a lot of other debt, then it was doomed from the start.

Also, I don’t like financial planners who took a few courses and passed an easy CFP test being able to advise people about finances.  Does he have a college degree in anything, much less a degree in business, economics, finance, etc.? 

It’s a lot like allowing High School grads with similar credentials providing financial advice on everyone’s most expensive purchase - their house.  It is unconscionable.

Astute Observation by Perspective
2011-11-09 01:29 PM

One more point.  I want people like him to explain their end-game.  What was the plan?  You bought a house you couldn’t afford, but you expected its value to increase substantially.  So what then?

e.g. You finance $575K on a < $100K income. It’s worth $1M in five years and you take your $400K equity and you buy a $2M house financing $1.6M.  Great!  You’re in a huge house in a great neighborhood and you feel rich, plus you have $400K in equity! 

But how do you plan to service that debt?  There is no end-game unless your income grows alongside the home’s value enabling you to finance the next big house.  Or is the plan to move to a low-cost area and take all of your cash with you?

I just don’t get the thought process back then and I want someone to explain theirs to me,

Astute Observation by Pwned
2011-11-09 01:39 PM

This guy’s article does a good job of summing up the crazy mentality of the credit bubble. My wife and I encountered the same thing in la. Endless communities of people paying insane house prices and then renovating them and filling them with expensive stuff. On top of that they all drove luxury cars, ate out all the time, took expensive vacations, sent their kids to rivate schools and were constantly buying new toys. Our initial reaction was that everyone must make way more money than us. It took us over a year to realize that we actually made way more income than they did! We just didn’t like debt. How so many people decided massive never-ending debt is ok is to me the biggest mystery of the bubble. It’s herd mentality taken to the extreme.

As for the weak settlement, I just hope it gets banks back on the foreclosure train. smile

Astute Observation by Perspective
2011-11-09 01:52 PM

His story about the frenzy over new developments reminds me of attending the grand opening of Avenue One.  I lived next door at Villa Siena at the time - a comparable rental property complex (nicer if you ask me).  The asking prices were outrageous and when I asked a couple of the very busy sales people “Why would I buy this and spend twice as much monthly as I’m spending next door?”, their answer was “it’s an investment” and “we can get you in a loan where your payment is lower than your rent, I promise.”

They were taking deposits by dozens of people that day.  You clearly felt that if you tried to take home the brochures and consider buying, you’d be too late.  And of course, the wait list would just keep growing for the next phase and you’d never get to buy one!

Crazy times…

Astute Observation by IrvineRenter
2011-11-09 09:14 AM

Irvine listings: 29% are distressed homes

By JONATHAN LANSNER

One analysis of real estate for sale in Irvine shows the market sluggish in its last tabulation.

Every two weeks, Orange County broker Steve Thomas of ReportOnHousing.com publishes a study of the supply of local homes for sale. Here’s what the latest report—as of October 27—has to say about Irvine …

  765 residences listed in brokers’ MLS system with 190 new deals opening in the past 30 days.
  By Thomas’s math, this community has a “market time” (months in would take to sell all inventory at current pace of new escrows) of 4.03 months vs. 3.92 months found two weeks earlier vs. 4.65 months seen a year earlier. Countywide, latest market time was 3.46 months vs. 4.28 months a year ago.
  So, homes in this community sell—in theory—in 16% more time than the countywide pace.
  Of the homes listed for sale in this community, 224 were either foreclosures being resold or short sales, where sellers owe more than the home’s value. So distressed properties were 29.3% of supply of homes for sale vs. 36.1% countywide.
  Homes for sale in Irvine represent 7.7% of Orange County inventory—and 6.3% of all the distressed homes listed for sale in Orange County. New escrows here are 6.7% of all Orange County’s new pending sales.

Astute Observation by Anonymous
2011-11-09 10:21 AM

How a Financial Pro Lost His House
http://www.nytimes.com/2011/11/09/business/how-a-financial-pro-lost-his-house.html?pagewanted=1&_r=1&hp;

Astute Observation by flyovercountry
2011-11-09 01:27 PM

Former Wachovia “exec” arrested for making meth.
http://www.charlotteobserver.com/2011/11/08/2758502/ex-wachovia-executive-husband.html

If she was earning $120k, the term executive is a bit of a loose term.  But it does make for a better headline.

Astute Observation by SanJoseRenter
2011-11-09 04:47 PM

Interesting that a 7% bond yield is considered “the point-of-no-return” for Italy - and tanking our stock markets by over 3%.

Imagine what that interest rate or so would do to US housing.

S&P 500 Plunges 3.7% With Italian Bond Yields Hitting ‘Point of No Return’

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