The entire thing is unbelievable, but the thing that struck me the most was 180 security cameras. What the hell is that about? Is 180 a brand or something?
At least it has NO ASBESTOS! Wow, that’s a real selling point for me.
Posted by AZDavidPhx on 02/15/08 at 04:38 AM
Peanuts, popcorn, Million dollar loans!
Get yer million dollar loans!
No down payment! Step right up!
Million dollar loans!
Get yer free million dollar loans! ——-
Posted by Kiran on 02/15/08 at 04:40 AM
No comment on the “Rarely on the market”?
It was on the market less than a year ago!
Were houses being flipped so often in Irvine that someone owning a property for more than six months is considered a ‘long time’?
Posted by AZDavidPhx on 02/15/08 at 04:45 AM
This place looks like a dumbass McMansion to me.
Not a whole lot of character. If it really is a beautiful property - the pictures don’t convey that. Maybe it’s just the greenish vomit colored paint that is turning me off.
Nice staging in the bedroom with the moving boxes and the defunct television on the floor. Only thing missing is a UHaul in driveway of the three car garage photo.
Posted by Hmmmm on 02/15/08 at 04:52 AM
I also like the back yard photos with a Kmart Special grill and Patio furniture. For this price you could at least move the junk out of the photo.
BTW…I love the green! It ‘s my favorite part. Make the house look fresh.
This should realistlcally be in the $650 range. Honestly, the bank deserves to eat the whole loan on this. I hope they choke on it.
Posted by AZDavidPhx on 02/15/08 at 04:53 AM
IR -
You only mentioned the seller’s drinking problem.
You forgot to include all of the around-the-clock “Flip This House”, “Who Wants To Be a Millionaire”, “Cribs”, and “Realtors Gone Wild” this dumbass was taking in.
Posted by AZDavidPhx on 02/15/08 at 05:05 AM
The fountain in the backyard looks out of place. Reminds me of Jeff Foxworthy’s “That’s like hanging a brand new chandelier in a haunted house”.
I’m guessing that the granite counters were put in 2-3 flips ago and the flippers after that had to take more desperate measures in order to play the “Upgrade” card on their victims.
Mabe today’s seller should upgrade the fountain with a designer granite bird bath Slip N Slide with solar powered timed bird feed.
Posted by ice weasel on 02/15/08 at 05:21 AM
One more addition to the parade of fools.
Posted by NoWow!way on 02/15/08 at 05:53 AM
Terrible shots of the neglected landscaping. Have they even bothered to water since last year’s purchase?
At least the price/per square foot is getting to more sane levels.
Posted by George8 on 02/15/08 at 06:03 AM
I’m actually surprised to see such low price per sf at this time. Is Valencia Park an athletic and sporting field? Do activities in the park make lots of excitement and noise?
Posted by doug r on 02/15/08 at 06:03 AM
Did that yard used to be a pool?
Posted by SacRenter on 02/15/08 at 06:33 AM
Wow…these are badly staged photos. If the house is vacant then who parked the car in the driveway…the realtor? He drove up and took pictures of the house with his car parked in them?
But some of the rooms looked lived in, sort of. They seem to have alot of junk in them so they look like a college kid is sleeping there.
Am I the only one who looks at MLS pictures and creates back stories about the people who live there? This homes back story is NOT good.
Posted by hb on 02/15/08 at 06:52 AM
Am I the only one who looks at MLS pictures and creates back stories about the people who live there?
Far from being the only one. This is the most fascinating part—imagining the human story behind the train wreck.
Posted by AZDavidPhx on 02/15/08 at 07:05 AM
Can anybody explain that 2 foot wide corridor of rooms? Seriously 2 tiles wide is all you get??
Seriously? A million dollars and you have to hug the wall and suck in your gut to get around each other in the hallway?
I don’t get it.
Posted by Emma Anne on 02/15/08 at 07:06 AM
It looks to me like the pictures were taken while the occupant was in the middle of moving out.
And could they have taken a picture that made that hall look any narrower? Or that grill look any crappier?
Posted by AZDavidPhx on 02/15/08 at 07:10 AM
Million dollar house; no pool or spa. Just a Home-Depot fountain and some grass. I can totally see the premium that this property commands.
Posted by NoWow!way on 02/15/08 at 07:14 AM
Here’s a little IHB trivia.
Readership has reportedly gone up from 2500 readers per month to 3500 readers per month in less than two months time.
I just saw someone promoting this blog on a local SA blog, too.
Posted by ipoplaya on 02/15/08 at 07:17 AM
It was brought on at a very low list George. It’s a very nice park. No lights. Has only a single soccer field. Not excitement and very little noise.
Posted by FairEconomist on 02/15/08 at 07:26 AM
That was purchased for less than $300/sq ft in May. That’s not peak pricing; that might well have been the lowest price in Irvine at the time, by a big margin. If so, not a blatantly foolish flip - rather, perhaps the least foolish flip done at the time.
Posted by ipoplaya on 02/15/08 at 07:27 AM
This one in the same neighborhood just closed for $280 per sf:
http://www.ipoplaya.com/47 CARRIAGE DR, Irvine, CA, $719,900, West Irvine Real Estate.mht
It’s 1,000sf smaller on a smaller lot in a worse location.
At $850K, this house is going to be in escrow by this time next week I’d think. I suspect the bank won’t take $850K on a short though or it’ll take them forever to take it… If this puppy was already owned by the bank, and they had this price on it, it’d be gone in a week for sure.
I’ve had 3-4 agents get in contact with me to make a run at this place. It’s the “hot deal” of the week around these parts.
Posted by ipoplaya on 02/15/08 at 07:30 AM
Then again, these places lease out for $3800-4000 so why buy it for $850K if one was already renting? It’s gonna fall to $700-750K…
Posted by tenmagnet on 02/15/08 at 07:38 AM
Ipop is right about this one being hustled by agents all over town.
I received numerous calls on it as well, starting on Sunday.
The location and low price per sq. foot hooked me initially. After viewing the pictures, I came away unimpressed. I asked about the long duration a short sale would take as well. The agent told me that this one would close quickly due to the fact that that both the first and second mortgages are held by the same bank.
Posted by AZDavidPhx on 02/15/08 at 07:40 AM
They were in over their head from the beginning.
It finally dawned on them that the game was over and they were holding the bag.
I wouldn’t be surprised if they just stopped making the payments too.
Too bad that the bank didn’t make them put some money down on this loan; it might have given the seller a reason to not head for the hills.
The banks will wise up eventually (one would think).
Posted by AZDavidPhx on 02/15/08 at 07:46 AM
I am assuming that the next victim to buy this house will have to come up with a little more than 0$ to put down.
Posted by ipoplaya on 02/15/08 at 08:13 AM
Good point FE. The average sales price in this tract for 2007 was approximately $290 per sf. They at least did $5 per sf better than that. Not the overpaying kind of super speculative flip. They at least paid a fair price based on comps…
Posted by ipoplaya on 02/15/08 at 08:16 AM
They will have to AZ or not get underwritten. Wish I like this tract… My place, within a short walking distance of this house, is selling for $350 per sf. If I bought this one at $850K, I could add 2000sf for $300K more. Paying an incremental $150 per sf ain’t a bad deal…
Posted by jhill on 02/15/08 at 08:34 AM
As one of the people who has started reading the blog recently, I want to join others in congratulating IR for an incredible job of analysis, made real by these case studies. However, I’m an anthropologist, not an economist, and I have an ex cathedra remark on the absurdly careless descriptions and photographs of houses like this one. I mean, they hope to sell this house for EIGHT HUNDRED AND FIFTY THOUSAND DOLLARS. A nice hunk of cash. The marketing strategies (or lack thereof) suggest to me that these realtors or banks or whoever they are are still not marketing to actual human beings who might want to live in such a house, and who would be quite successful people who want to present a positive image of themselves. For that, you need to build a nice story, about a successful family who made the place beautiful and enjoyed living there. The old “clean out the closets, bake cookies before the open house and put a pot of geraniums on the front porch” strategy. But in Southern California there is no point in doing this because in fact almost nobody can afford such a house. In 2005-06 “affordability” in Southern California ( number of people who could afford to buy a median priced house) was running 9-15 %. And, while house prices are dropping, incomes are emphatically not rising, and the two-income strategy has just about played itself out. So there is a very small market of actual families who want to be homeowners for such a place. And it is apparent that realtors are still marketing, not to potential homeowners, but to investors. Otherwise, they would bleeding well take 5 minutes to clear the trash out of the back yard before they took the pictures.
Posted by awgee on 02/15/08 at 09:00 AM
For months I have been reading, “The fed will lower the fed funds rate and mortgage rates will fall.“
The fed has lowered the fed funds rate from 5.25% a year ago to 3% and 30 yr. mortgage rates have gone from 5.82% to 5.68% in that same time; a drop of 0.14%. Hmmm-m-m-m-m.
Posted by Chuck on 02/15/08 at 09:08 AM
I completely agree with this. It baffles me that many real estate agents don’t seem to have the basic work ethic or professionalism to clean a place up and take some GOOD pictures, let alone write a description of the property that makes sense and has been spell checked. Can you imagine how quickly we would get fired if you or I submitted this type of work to OUR clients? And what about the sellers - why do they put up with this type of crappy work? This case is different, because they seem to be essentially selling the house for the bank, but check out the following listing on the MLS and see if you can count the spelling errors. Why don’t the sellers call the agent and read him the riot act for this crap? $1.385 million for this house, and here is the description from the agent (and the lame explanation for why the house has gone unsold for 238 days:
PRICED TO SEEL- $150K BELOW MARKET! TERMS!! NO BANK QUALFIYING OWC. FOR SALE, LEASE OPTION, LEASE OR CONTRACT OF SALE & SUBJECT TO EXISTING LOAN. PROF LANDSCP’SEE VIRTUAL TOUR & PICS. MODEL PERFECT 4 BEDROOM W/ 3 ALL NEW BATHROOMS. COMPLETLY UPGRADED THRUOUT. 180 SECURITY CAMERAS. NEW HARDWOOD FLOORING, LAUNDRY ROOM, NEWER HIGH END APPLIANCES, PARIS EURO CABINETS, LOW MAINTENANCE YARD W/ SPA, PELLA FINE FINISH DUAL PAYNE WINDOWS W/ SCREENS INSIDE WINDOW. SOLAR, 2 NEW ACS & ALL NEW DUCTS W/ NO ASBESTOS!LIGHT & BRIGHT W/ 2 FRPLS. COMPLETLY FENCED FOR SAFETY. PVT BACK YARD. PROF LANDSCP. OVERSIZED LARGE FINISHED 2+ SUV GARAGE W/ CEILING STORAGE & CEILING EHAUST. NO SIGN UP. TENANTS OCCUPIED IS ONLY REASON FOR LONG LISTING TIME.
It has been related to you previously that you cannot compare different markets. This is a nice home in a good location at a decent price per square foot. The realtor did a horrible job of displaying the home and took bad pictures.
I guess with it being a short sale and a cheap price, they are assuming it will sell regardless. We all agree, price is everything right now.
Personally my wife and I are looking for a home like this in that it is somewhat generic and can be individualized to your own personal taste with minimal investment.
This is the best “deal” I have seen in Irvine to date…..
Posted by former_irvine_resident on 02/15/08 at 09:15 AM
Excellent observation jhill and for those of us who have followed IR’s blog longer we have certainly seen some doozies. I particularly liked the sideways pictures from just a few days ago - that was a classic!
We have had a good time laughing at Realtards pathetic attempts to market these ‘special’ Irvine homes. Does anyone have some favorites they’d like to share?
I know when I purchased in 2001 near the beginning of the run up, it was amazing to me the poor quality condition of many homes I toured. I think that many of todays newer Realtards simply don’t get it. During the bubble they literally did nothing to stage homes and they sold. Now it is obviously much more difficult and they either lack the skill or experience to take even the most basic steps in preparing a home.
Posted by ipoplaya on 02/15/08 at 09:22 AM
Wishful thinking by those who don’t understand mortgage markets. Short rates have fallen and will likely fall if the Fed keeps dropping. Long rates seem to be doing nothing but move up… I think 30-year conforming rates have moved up almost half a point since emergency Fed drop and stimulus package announcement.
Jumbos 30-years are at a 4-month high right now. I think many would-be buyers are counting on the conforming loan limit increase. Another .50 to .75 move up in conforming rates, and whatever rate decrease as a result of the stimulus package for formerly jumbo borrowers that would have been will mostly be gone.
Posted by camsavem on 02/15/08 at 09:22 AM
The fed funds rate has NOTHING to do with morgage rates.
Equity lines - yes
Credit Cards - yes
Auto loans - yes
Mortgage - no
Mortgage rates are set off of the 10 year treasury rate.
Posted by 7 on 02/15/08 at 09:24 AM
As mentioned before, the fed funds rate is not tied with the mortgage rate. The fed’s rate can fall to ( negative 5.0%) and the 30 yrs rate can still be 5% or higher. The only one that helped by the fed fund rate is the adjustable rate like credit card, maybe car loan and such, I think. No bank going to lend you hundreds of thousand dollars at a commited rate for 30 yrs. if they need to figure in the inflation and future interest rate.
Posted by IrvineResident on 02/15/08 at 09:43 AM
Most Sellers are still in denial. the number of unsold homes will continue to surge simply because market participants can not bear sellers’ price.
does anyone think this seller really wants a sell?
20 North Torrey PNE
Irvine, CA 92620
Price: $8,000,000
Buy with Redfin and Save $160,000*
Beds: 3
Baths: 2
Sq. Ft.: 1,765
$/Sq. Ft.: $4,533
Lot Size: 5,000 Sq. Ft.
Type: Single Family Residence
Style: Other
Year Built: 2006
Stories: One Level
Area: West Irvine
County: Orange
MLS#: P618797
Status: Active
On Redfin: 24 days
This seller wants 364% appreciation in less than 9 years?
31 ARBORWOOD, Irvine, CA 92620
List Price: $2,100,000
Last Sale: 07/28/99
Sales Price: $576,500
Bedrooms: 5
Full Baths: 5
Partial Baths: 0
Square Feet: 3,700
Lot Size: 17,000 Sq. Ft.
Year Built: 1999
Listing Date: 02/14/08
On Market: 1 day
Type: SFR
Status: ACTIVE
MLS #: S521726
Not true cams. Shorter duration ARMs are not as tied to the 10-year. That is why you will see that 5/1 ARM rates dropped down in January and have stayed mostly down in spite of the recent moves in the 10-year which was pushed up rates on 30-year products… 1 and 3-year ARMs are definitely much more affected by Fed drops.
Posted by Chuck on 02/15/08 at 09:53 AM
The only thing I can think of is he meant to say 180 degree security cameras. But actually wouldn’t you want 360 degree coverage for the front and the back of the house? Who knows.
And yes, this house is asbestos and radiation free! Where do I sign?
Posted by IrvineResident on 02/15/08 at 09:56 AM
I get daily update of newly listed homes from ziprealty. My observation of asking prices is that selles are still in denial. The number of unsold homes will continue to surge in a rapid pace. The market participants can not bear seller WTF price.
Trust your eyes when you see this seller asking price, does anybody suspect the owner wants a sell?
20 North Torrey PNE
Irvine, CA 92620
Price: $8,000,000
Buy with Redfin and Save $160,000*
Beds: 3
Baths: 2
Sq. Ft.: 1,765
$/Sq. Ft.: $4,533
Lot Size: 5,000 Sq. Ft.
Type: Single Family Residence
Style: Other
Year Built: 2006
Stories: One Level
Area: West Irvine
County: Orange
MLS#: P618797
Status: Active
On Redfin: 24 days
The next seller wants 364% appreciation in less than 9 years for an asset that barely beats inflation.
31 ARBORWOOD, Irvine, CA 92620
List Price: $2,100,000
Last Sale: 07/28/99
Sales Price: $576,500
Bedrooms: 5
Full Baths: 5
Partial Baths: 0
Square Feet: 3,700
Lot Size: 17,000 Sq. Ft.
Year Built: 1999
Listing Date: 02/14/08
On Market: 1 day
Type: SFR
Status: ACTIVE
MLS #: S521726
Posted by IrvineResident on 02/15/08 at 09:57 AM
sorry for the double post
Posted by Chuck on 02/15/08 at 10:00 AM
One word - TYPO. There are no $8 million houses for sale in West Irvine. It must be $800,000. The assessed value is $847,354.
Posted by ipoplaya on 02/15/08 at 10:13 AM
LOL. And the Torrey Pine property is not in West Irvine either… That’s one good realtor there. Torrey Pine is in Northwood II, where there is much on the market and sellers will be going under.
Posted by MMG on 02/15/08 at 10:17 AM
as Nanowest any I have said a few months ago:
200 and below for SqFt, HERE WE COME :mrgreen:
Posted by MMG on 02/15/08 at 10:20 AM
Ipo said:—->Then again, these places lease out for $3800-4000 so why buy it for $850K if one was already renting? It’s gonna fall to $700-750K…
Ipo is becoming one mean bear
Posted by MMG on 02/15/08 at 10:24 AM
to date being the key word :mrgreen:
I have to agree with AZ, this is one McPOS place that will still go down in price due to the fact that >800k is alot of money to pay for a house even in Irvine,
once the market finishs the fall off the cliff, people will think many many times about where to park 170k for down payment and pay 4-5 k per month. it’s all about psychology and mood of buyers.
Posted by skek on 02/15/08 at 10:27 AM
Outstanding find! I like the fact that the home simultaneously has a long term tenant (hence why it hasn’t sold in nearly a year) but it’s available for lease. In my industry, this type of work would get you fired—not a $30k commission. Amazing.
Posted by Andrew on 02/15/08 at 10:37 AM
A Nissan Sentra in the driveway of a supposed million-dollar house? Great sales pitch there.
Posted by ipoplaya on 02/15/08 at 10:41 AM
Arborwood is an insane price. That is more expensive than anything on New Dawn, and the New Dawn tract is in a much better location and nicer IMO. A home not far from this Arborwood place, 5 Roselead also with 5 bedrooms and over 3000sf, went back to the bank in August for $1.15M and sold in November for $1.2M.
Arborwood does have a crazy big and cool lot though. Sucks that it backs to Portola.
Posted by 25w100k+ on 02/15/08 at 10:47 AM
Uh, didn’t you know? AZ lives in a really sweet apartment in the middle of the desert, duh! He would never want to move into a big place like this when he’s living the high life!
Posted by ipoplaya on 02/15/08 at 10:57 AM
I drove by Legacy today on the way to work… The house next to it has a large collection of jallopy (sp?) vehicles. IMO that neighborhood has a pretty high WT look-and-feel going on. The backyard fence, on the frontside of the house has collapsed, i.e. you can see right into the ole backyard. Nice. Little bit of a fixer upper. Appears that people are still living there and there is no realtor sign out front.
Posted by tenmagnet on 02/15/08 at 10:58 AM
Ipop,
As soon as I looked up Arborwood on the map, immediately knew you were going to mention that it backs up to Portola. Funny thing is I never cared about that before but its come up so frequently in your comments and in our discussions that I’m starting to view that as a negative as well. Looked at 46 Logan this morning in Woodbury, like the location and price but was thinking it seems awfully close to Irvine Blvd.
Posted by NanoWest on 02/15/08 at 10:59 AM
MMG,
Yes 200 PSF will be the norm for SFR in Irvine…........condos may sink to 150 PSF.
Regarding todays property: 5 beds and 4 baths. Would be a good home for a big or multi-gen family. Better put everyone to work to make the payment and pay the taxes etc.
I would pay 550k for it, but its really not my type of place. I like the square footage, but too many beds.
The lot size, location and curb appeal is very good.
Look at the 1998 selling price if you want to see the lunacy that has taken over in America since then.
Posted by Irvinewanabe on 02/15/08 at 11:14 AM
I think the North Torrey price of $8,000,000 must be a typo. The original list price from the Redfin info below is $780,000. My guess is they meant to list for $800,000.
That in itself is an issue. I guess if you can’t sell at the original asking price you should INCREASE the price not lower the price. What a concept! That should really pull those buyers in!!!!
Listing Price Information
List Price High: $8,000,000.00
List Price Low: $8,000,000.00
Original List Price: $780,000.00
Search Price High: $8,000,000.00
Search Price Low: $8,000,000.00
Posted by ipoplaya on 02/15/08 at 11:20 AM
What’s the three most important things in real estate? Location, location, location. Personally, if I am dropping big coin on a house, I don’t want to have a street that rivals highways in most states, just beyond my 6’ wall.
Think about that Valente property. It is way nicer than Parma inside. Same plan I believe, definitely same size. Which one got into escrow? People love that Valente lot, well, at least until they look over the wall…
I use Portola to get from West Irvine over to the Woodbury area more often than not. Drive is nice, green lights all the way usually. I fly by the backyard of Arborwood at 60-65mph. People will say, “oh, with the double-paned windows closed you can barely hear the cars”.
Maybe I am old school, but I want to be able to keep my windows open! I sure as heck don’t want to have to put in a water feature in the backyard just to get some white noise… More often than not, if you see a listing with a fountain in the backyard, that probably means it’s got lots of road noise.
Posted by AZDavidPhx on 02/15/08 at 11:34 AM
camsavem -
“It has been related to you previously that you cannot compare different markets.“
Which post of mine are you referring to? I just said that I didn’t get what the deal was with the narrow hallway and you come at me with this “you can’t compare different markets” salvo.
Posted by tenmagnet on 02/15/08 at 11:38 AM
Yeah, I understand where you’re coming from. Since we’re both looking in to buy in the same market/area, and generally in the same price range, I pay close attention to your comments. Looking at the 46 Logan location today made me think of your location comments. Definitely a positive.
Posted by Silly's Mom on 02/15/08 at 11:38 AM
Either it’s a typo because the original listing price was $780 K and they upped it to 800K and added an extra zero by accident, or it was a ploy to be featured on this blog for the free advertising.
I agree with IPOP on the price on Arborwood - crazy! I love Somerton and had originally hoped to get in over there, but it’ll never happen unless prices drop a LOT more. Which of course, they may!
Posted by AZDavidPhx on 02/15/08 at 11:39 AM
25w100k+
The ego is larger than the bank account!
Posted by Silly's Mom on 02/15/08 at 11:39 AM
Somehow I didn’t see the above comment making the same point as me… sorry!
Posted by AZDavidPhx on 02/15/08 at 11:44 AM
People on ebay put more effort into describing a piece of toast shaped like Jesus than these people put into describing a million dollar house.
Good call!
Posted by 4walls4me on 02/15/08 at 11:49 AM
If this is a flip/investment property, then the loan is a recourse one, right?
Doesn’t that mean the bank can take whatever $$ this flipper has from previous flips? Don’t they get to go after his assets in this case?
Posted by Silly's Mom on 02/15/08 at 11:50 AM
You know they say “3 kids is the new 2” so if you want to have a guest room (or a room for Grandma) and a room for the 3 kids, then you need 5 bedrooms. Of course, in a recession (oops, I used the R word) people will probably choose to have fewer children.
Posted by tenmagnet on 02/15/08 at 11:58 AM
Personally, I prefer Rosegate over Somerton but at this point agree with you about the need for substantially price declines before we can all get in either one.
Posted by Silly's Mom on 02/15/08 at 11:58 AM
Hey IPOP - new this week 41 New Dawn, listed for a whopping $2,299,000! Those Rosegate people must get the koolaid piped in by the IRWD.
Posted by former_irvine_resident on 02/15/08 at 11:59 AM
I learned that lesson when I sold my first home… Or rather I should say, tried to sell my first home. I needed to find the best deal I could since I was still in college (grad school) so I ended up buying next to a cement plant and a landfill. Needless to say it took a while to sell the place.
When I bought in Irvine I took my time to find a place that had a good location, location, and location. Close to schools, easy access to major roads but not right on one, and in a cul-de-sac. It was pretty easy to sell in Sep06 when I needed to leave. I priced a bit below market and it was out of my hands in less than a month.
There is truly something to be said for location, location, location!
Posted by tenmagnet on 02/15/08 at 12:09 PM
OMG! Haven’t seen this one before, probably because of the hefty $$$ price tag.
This will certainly not help me with the seller of 1 New Dawn.
I’ve been trying to talk this guy down to no avail these past few months. No wonder, the koolaide must be flowing freely over there.
Posted by rkp on 02/15/08 at 12:15 PM
We always wonder what the owners were thinking. How about if IHB adds a new feature where they actually interview the owners. Imagine how much more interesting these posts will be if we knew what the owner was thinking!
What do you say IR? A simple way to start would be an email based interview.
Posted by momopi on 02/15/08 at 12:17 PM
For whatever the reason, this house doesn’t really give me good vibes. It just feels “wrong” somehow. I would not want to buy or live there, and it has nothing to do with the price per sq ft.
Posted by Silly's Mom on 02/15/08 at 12:23 PM
Tenmagnet: I like Rosegate too, but I think 4200 square feet is just too much house for me to take care of. Somerton is approx. 3300-3700 (I think) and that sounds much more reasonable for me personally. I also think that Rosegate has dated looking exterior color schemes - lots of white and cream. But that’s just me! Good luck with the 1 New Dawn. He’s probably thrilled with this new listing, because suddenly his house looks like the bargain in the tract!
Posted by Rocker on 02/15/08 at 12:23 PM
Yikes!
An acquaintance bought a similar property close to this house in fall of 2005 for $1M, this was their 3rd house in 3 years!, a serial upgrader case, their previous trades were successful because the bull market, but if they sell today (or are forced to sell) they will lose their down payment which probably included all equity gained in their previous trades, they had this big assumption about Irvine RE going up, up an up.
The lesson here is, same as stocks, you need to diversify!, it was wrong to rollover all the previous equity gained into another house.
Posted by NoWow!way on 02/15/08 at 12:39 PM
People will say, “oh, with the double-paned windows closed you can barely hear the cars”.
And no one should underestimate the grime and grit from a high traffic area. I’ve lived close to busy streets. You can tune out the noise, but that gross air quality from traffic lands in your home and you can feel and see it when you wipe and dust. And you’ll do that a lot more often, too
Posted by ipoplaya on 02/15/08 at 12:46 PM
Hey ten, you watch Northpark too right? Just saw the closing price on 8 Pacific Grove, which is 2830sf, just like the Sunnyvale place that closed a few months back. Sold for $1.025M and closed yesterday. It actually went for MORE than the previous comp of the same exact model…
Pacific Grove did have quite a bit sunk in landscaping though, so the price in real terms was probably a bit less than the recent Sunnyvale close.
Enjoyed reading your comments; you bring up some very good points. The fact that these sellers aren’t coming down is very discouraging. What do you think about the two on Woodhaven Lane?
Posted by HAPPYHEART on 02/15/08 at 12:52 PM
We sold our home last year after having it on the market for 13 months. I used an older gentleman realtor who was quite high up in the NAR organization. The main picture of our house on the MLS prominently displayed his steel yard (pounded into the front lawn). The pictures of the backyard were taken from inside the house through a window. Then, to further have potential buyers licking their chops he added verbage like “wall to wall” carpet, and “built in 1977” and “fresh paint”. The house had four bedrooms, however we used the forth bedroom as an office, but I had to fight him to list as a 4 bedroom house. He insisted it was only 3 because we had built-ins the office. He was a nice guy, and I didn’t want to dump him, so I rewrote the listing myself and took out 90% of his lines. I actually used language that would entice a buyer to want to look at the house, which was beautifully remodeled with granite and custom travertine floors etc. Who the hell would WANT to look at a house built in 1977??? I also had to force him to replace his pictures with better shots. I’m still kicking myself for paying a 5% commission when I did everything but draw up the escrow papers.
Posted by Peter on 02/15/08 at 01:01 PM
Never moved in???
Posted by tenmagnet on 02/15/08 at 01:25 PM
Thanks for the info and the link. 8 Pacific Grove looks nice; personally I like it better than the two on Sunnyvale. 18 Sunnyvale, which is listed on your site (great site, btw) is already in escrow. It will be interesting to see where that one closes. Along with 8 Pacific Grove it will certainly impact the pricing of 16 Sunnyvale, which still remains on the market.
Are you thinking of making a run at 16 Sunnyvale?
Posted by CapitalismWorks on 02/15/08 at 01:37 PM
The best bet would be to follow up on closed sales. I can’t imagine a home owner in the process of selling have much interest in tipping their hand.
Posted by ipoplaya on 02/15/08 at 01:38 PM
16 SV is the exact same home as 8 PG, just not as nice. I think 16 SV is probably worth around $975Kish based on the 8 PG comp.
We made a run at 12 Sunnyvale, also this same model, but couldn’t get them to go under $1M. It closed in December for just a smidge above $1M.
I like the interior layout of this plan. Big great room. Dining and small living are not contiguous. Big loft area at the top of the stairs. Bedrooms are decent sized as well. Downstairs bedroom is teeny tiny though. Can’t really double as an office and guest bedroom IMO. Perfect for an office if your guests will pull up a floatie in the loft…
Posted by CapitalismWorks on 02/15/08 at 01:41 PM
Some Positive news out of Detroit (from Drudgereport).
Trying to get $100K more than 2006 purchase? Good luck. Malibu could be the next big REO in NP…
Posted by Genius on 02/15/08 at 01:48 PM
“It has been related to you previously that you cannot compare different markets.“
Because real estate is local, right? RIGHT?
“Irvine is different.“
Posted by rkp on 02/15/08 at 01:55 PM
Well if its a short sale, there isn’t much to tip their hands. Though I agree it would be hard to convince a seller to share anything. There isn’t any benefit for them.
Posted by Genius on 02/15/08 at 02:09 PM
To paraphrase from something you wrote the other day, the whole state should be free. All of the transplants I know from Michigan are very happy to be out.
Posted by tenmagnet on 02/15/08 at 02:13 PM
Yeah, I agree 22 Malibu is completely un-realistic, not to mention 6 Malibu has more appeal and is priced significantly lower. Nonetheless, I wouldn’t mind seeing either of these breach the $1M mark.
It makes sense that you would make such an ignorant comment since you are from the state with the most liberal senator in the United States. It is the Virgin Mary that chooses to signal blessings by appearing in silhouette on various food items. Not Christ. Don’t think that I didn’t pick up on the anti-Christian undertone of your statement. I think it shows cowardice when people choose to speak in code against the only people capable of love.
What exactly is it that you have against Christian Americans anyway? I mean, I could understand that every so often a person might make an off color comment or two, but ever since I’ve visited this blog I’ve noticed that you have never once mentioned how great this country is nor have you ever condemned the actions of Islamofascist terrorists.
I pray nightly for people like you. I pray that our Lord shows you that you are wrong to live such a resentful existence. I pray that He gently explains why you are going to burn for your sins just before you are licked by the flames of eternal damnation. Unlike you, I have compassion for my fellow man.
Posted by Purplehaze on 02/15/08 at 04:24 PM
Hey Kirk,
Why the white supremacist christian dialogue? Why the claim on christians being the only religion in the world capable of love? Any exclusivist claim is pure BS. There were many religiions before christianity even came into the picture. If those religions are not claiming superiority, you should at least be humble enough and admit that there are other paths to god.
Peace out!
Posted by lendingmaestro on 02/15/08 at 04:52 PM
Why are security cameras need in Newport Beach? Was this house used as a meth lab?
Posted by lendingmaestro on 02/15/08 at 04:59 PM
Dude, WTF, is this a joke? That $8 mil price tag has to be a joke or misprint, It has to!
If you told me that the moon was actually a secret alien space station which has been spying on us for a few millennia, I’d believe it before that home’s price.
We have a word for the vitriol you have thrown my way: blasphemy.
Love comes from God’s love and if you’d ever bother to read the Bible you would know that God only loves those who worship His Son. There’s no point in you reading it now though, because Jesus teaches that once a sin has been committed there can be no forgiveness. I’m sorry you weren’t taught this early enough.
Posted by ex-tangelo on 02/15/08 at 08:24 PM
Wait, the what? People put kids in separate bedrooms?
I’ve got the kids piled up in one bedroom like cordwood. Get used to it, kiddos, and college dorms will feel spacious! Bwahahahaha
...
(Don’t ask me about the Mini Cooper with two child seats in the back, either. And by the way, I’m six feet tall)
Posted by Trooper on 02/15/08 at 08:28 PM
Jesus wasn’t in the toast, silly ! It was a grilled cheese sandwich.
It’s also brake dust and rubber dust. At least they don’t use asbestos brake linings anymore. But that rubber is no good for your lungs.
Our house is 250 feet from a 4-lane lightly-traveled expressway, and we get black dust on horizontal surfaces outside. And there isn’t nearly the traffic volume on that as you get from any of those big Irvine arterials like Barranca or Irvine Ctr Drive or whatever…
Posted by ex-tangelo on 02/15/08 at 08:59 PM
Silly’s Mom: At least it has NO ASBESTOS! Wow, that’s a real selling point for me.
btw, California’s state rock is “Serpentinite”
Serpentinite can contain chrysotile, the serpentine mineral that crystallizes in long, thin fibers. This is the mineral commonly known as asbestos.
*California* contains asbestos…
Posted by George8 on 02/15/08 at 09:35 PM
Sold to IPO, $850K. I think it is a decent buy if you can have good use of it.
Posted by Lost Cause on 02/15/08 at 10:05 PM
Of course, the best memories of Irvine come from the Grateful Dead at Irvine Meadows. Two alien worlds collide.
Posted by Lost Cause on 02/15/08 at 10:08 PM
There is also lead that persists along heavily travelled older roads, from the decades of leaded gasoline.
Posted by AZDavidPhx on 02/16/08 at 04:21 AM
That’s an awful lot to read into my post there, Kirk.
Thanks for your prayers though. That gave me an idea -
We should start a housing prayer group. With a little help from above, we might be able to pray house prices back down into normalcy.
Posted by cyberpunk on 02/16/08 at 04:59 AM
KirkTroll, please go back under your rock and come out when you can be on-topic.
Posted by cyberpunk on 02/16/08 at 05:29 AM
You’re not joking, I have two adjoining neighbors with five people in each two bedroom apartment! That’s two adults with three kids in each two bedroom apartment! They must hate me for taking up a whole two bed apartment by myself! LOL
Posted by Silly's Mom on 02/15/08 at 09:49 AM
The entire thing is unbelievable, but the thing that struck me the most was 180 security cameras. What the hell is that about? Is 180 a brand or something?
At least it has NO ASBESTOS! Wow, that’s a real selling point for me.
Posted by AZDavidPhx on 02/15/08 at 04:38 AM
Peanuts, popcorn, Million dollar loans!
Get yer million dollar loans!
No down payment! Step right up!
Million dollar loans!
Get yer free million dollar loans!
——-
Posted by Kiran on 02/15/08 at 04:40 AM
No comment on the “Rarely on the market”?
It was on the market less than a year ago!
Were houses being flipped so often in Irvine that someone owning a property for more than six months is considered a ‘long time’?
Posted by AZDavidPhx on 02/15/08 at 04:45 AM
This place looks like a dumbass McMansion to me.
Not a whole lot of character. If it really is a beautiful property - the pictures don’t convey that. Maybe it’s just the greenish vomit colored paint that is turning me off.
Nice staging in the bedroom with the moving boxes and the defunct television on the floor. Only thing missing is a UHaul in driveway of the three car garage photo.
Posted by Hmmmm on 02/15/08 at 04:52 AM
I also like the back yard photos with a Kmart Special grill and Patio furniture. For this price you could at least move the junk out of the photo.
BTW…I love the green! It ‘s my favorite part. Make the house look fresh.
This should realistlcally be in the $650 range. Honestly, the bank deserves to eat the whole loan on this. I hope they choke on it.
Posted by AZDavidPhx on 02/15/08 at 04:53 AM
IR -
You only mentioned the seller’s drinking problem.
You forgot to include all of the around-the-clock “Flip This House”, “Who Wants To Be a Millionaire”, “Cribs”, and “Realtors Gone Wild” this dumbass was taking in.
Posted by AZDavidPhx on 02/15/08 at 05:05 AM
The fountain in the backyard looks out of place. Reminds me of Jeff Foxworthy’s “That’s like hanging a brand new chandelier in a haunted house”.
I’m guessing that the granite counters were put in 2-3 flips ago and the flippers after that had to take more desperate measures in order to play the “Upgrade” card on their victims.
Mabe today’s seller should upgrade the fountain with a designer granite bird bath Slip N Slide with solar powered timed bird feed.
Posted by ice weasel on 02/15/08 at 05:21 AM
One more addition to the parade of fools.
Posted by NoWow!way on 02/15/08 at 05:53 AM
Terrible shots of the neglected landscaping. Have they even bothered to water since last year’s purchase?
At least the price/per square foot is getting to more sane levels.
Posted by George8 on 02/15/08 at 06:03 AM
I’m actually surprised to see such low price per sf at this time. Is Valencia Park an athletic and sporting field? Do activities in the park make lots of excitement and noise?
Posted by doug r on 02/15/08 at 06:03 AM
Did that yard used to be a pool?
Posted by SacRenter on 02/15/08 at 06:33 AM
Wow…these are badly staged photos. If the house is vacant then who parked the car in the driveway…the realtor? He drove up and took pictures of the house with his car parked in them?
But some of the rooms looked lived in, sort of. They seem to have alot of junk in them so they look like a college kid is sleeping there.
Am I the only one who looks at MLS pictures and creates back stories about the people who live there? This homes back story is NOT good.
Posted by hb on 02/15/08 at 06:52 AM
Am I the only one who looks at MLS pictures and creates back stories about the people who live there?
Far from being the only one. This is the most fascinating part—imagining the human story behind the train wreck.
Posted by AZDavidPhx on 02/15/08 at 07:05 AM
Can anybody explain that 2 foot wide corridor of rooms? Seriously 2 tiles wide is all you get??
Seriously? A million dollars and you have to hug the wall and suck in your gut to get around each other in the hallway?
I don’t get it.
Posted by Emma Anne on 02/15/08 at 07:06 AM
It looks to me like the pictures were taken while the occupant was in the middle of moving out.
And could they have taken a picture that made that hall look any narrower? Or that grill look any crappier?
Posted by AZDavidPhx on 02/15/08 at 07:10 AM
Million dollar house; no pool or spa. Just a Home-Depot fountain and some grass. I can totally see the premium that this property commands.
Posted by NoWow!way on 02/15/08 at 07:14 AM
Here’s a little IHB trivia.
Readership has reportedly gone up from 2500 readers per month to 3500 readers per month in less than two months time.
I just saw someone promoting this blog on a local SA blog, too.
Posted by ipoplaya on 02/15/08 at 07:17 AM
It was brought on at a very low list George. It’s a very nice park. No lights. Has only a single soccer field. Not excitement and very little noise.
Posted by FairEconomist on 02/15/08 at 07:26 AM
That was purchased for less than $300/sq ft in May. That’s not peak pricing; that might well have been the lowest price in Irvine at the time, by a big margin. If so, not a blatantly foolish flip - rather, perhaps the least foolish flip done at the time.
Posted by ipoplaya on 02/15/08 at 07:27 AM
This one in the same neighborhood just closed for $280 per sf:
http://www.ipoplaya.com/47 CARRIAGE DR, Irvine, CA, $719,900, West Irvine Real Estate.mht
It’s 1,000sf smaller on a smaller lot in a worse location.
At $850K, this house is going to be in escrow by this time next week I’d think. I suspect the bank won’t take $850K on a short though or it’ll take them forever to take it… If this puppy was already owned by the bank, and they had this price on it, it’d be gone in a week for sure.
I’ve had 3-4 agents get in contact with me to make a run at this place. It’s the “hot deal” of the week around these parts.
Posted by ipoplaya on 02/15/08 at 07:30 AM
Then again, these places lease out for $3800-4000 so why buy it for $850K if one was already renting? It’s gonna fall to $700-750K…
Posted by tenmagnet on 02/15/08 at 07:38 AM
Ipop is right about this one being hustled by agents all over town.
I received numerous calls on it as well, starting on Sunday.
The location and low price per sq. foot hooked me initially. After viewing the pictures, I came away unimpressed. I asked about the long duration a short sale would take as well. The agent told me that this one would close quickly due to the fact that that both the first and second mortgages are held by the same bank.
Posted by AZDavidPhx on 02/15/08 at 07:40 AM
They were in over their head from the beginning.
It finally dawned on them that the game was over and they were holding the bag.
I wouldn’t be surprised if they just stopped making the payments too.
Too bad that the bank didn’t make them put some money down on this loan; it might have given the seller a reason to not head for the hills.
The banks will wise up eventually (one would think).
Posted by AZDavidPhx on 02/15/08 at 07:46 AM
I am assuming that the next victim to buy this house will have to come up with a little more than 0$ to put down.
Posted by ipoplaya on 02/15/08 at 08:13 AM
Good point FE. The average sales price in this tract for 2007 was approximately $290 per sf. They at least did $5 per sf better than that. Not the overpaying kind of super speculative flip. They at least paid a fair price based on comps…
Posted by ipoplaya on 02/15/08 at 08:16 AM
They will have to AZ or not get underwritten. Wish I like this tract… My place, within a short walking distance of this house, is selling for $350 per sf. If I bought this one at $850K, I could add 2000sf for $300K more. Paying an incremental $150 per sf ain’t a bad deal…
Posted by jhill on 02/15/08 at 08:34 AM
As one of the people who has started reading the blog recently, I want to join others in congratulating IR for an incredible job of analysis, made real by these case studies. However, I’m an anthropologist, not an economist, and I have an ex cathedra remark on the absurdly careless descriptions and photographs of houses like this one. I mean, they hope to sell this house for EIGHT HUNDRED AND FIFTY THOUSAND DOLLARS. A nice hunk of cash. The marketing strategies (or lack thereof) suggest to me that these realtors or banks or whoever they are are still not marketing to actual human beings who might want to live in such a house, and who would be quite successful people who want to present a positive image of themselves. For that, you need to build a nice story, about a successful family who made the place beautiful and enjoyed living there. The old “clean out the closets, bake cookies before the open house and put a pot of geraniums on the front porch” strategy. But in Southern California there is no point in doing this because in fact almost nobody can afford such a house. In 2005-06 “affordability” in Southern California ( number of people who could afford to buy a median priced house) was running 9-15 %. And, while house prices are dropping, incomes are emphatically not rising, and the two-income strategy has just about played itself out. So there is a very small market of actual families who want to be homeowners for such a place. And it is apparent that realtors are still marketing, not to potential homeowners, but to investors. Otherwise, they would bleeding well take 5 minutes to clear the trash out of the back yard before they took the pictures.
Posted by awgee on 02/15/08 at 09:00 AM
For months I have been reading, “The fed will lower the fed funds rate and mortgage rates will fall.“
The fed has lowered the fed funds rate from 5.25% a year ago to 3% and 30 yr. mortgage rates have gone from 5.82% to 5.68% in that same time; a drop of 0.14%. Hmmm-m-m-m-m.
Posted by Chuck on 02/15/08 at 09:08 AM
I completely agree with this. It baffles me that many real estate agents don’t seem to have the basic work ethic or professionalism to clean a place up and take some GOOD pictures, let alone write a description of the property that makes sense and has been spell checked. Can you imagine how quickly we would get fired if you or I submitted this type of work to OUR clients? And what about the sellers - why do they put up with this type of crappy work? This case is different, because they seem to be essentially selling the house for the bank, but check out the following listing on the MLS and see if you can count the spelling errors. Why don’t the sellers call the agent and read him the riot act for this crap? $1.385 million for this house, and here is the description from the agent (and the lame explanation for why the house has gone unsold for 238 days:
PRICED TO SEEL- $150K BELOW MARKET! TERMS!! NO BANK QUALFIYING OWC. FOR SALE, LEASE OPTION, LEASE OR CONTRACT OF SALE & SUBJECT TO EXISTING LOAN. PROF LANDSCP’SEE VIRTUAL TOUR & PICS. MODEL PERFECT 4 BEDROOM W/ 3 ALL NEW BATHROOMS. COMPLETLY UPGRADED THRUOUT. 180 SECURITY CAMERAS. NEW HARDWOOD FLOORING, LAUNDRY ROOM, NEWER HIGH END APPLIANCES, PARIS EURO CABINETS, LOW MAINTENANCE YARD W/ SPA, PELLA FINE FINISH DUAL PAYNE WINDOWS W/ SCREENS INSIDE WINDOW. SOLAR, 2 NEW ACS & ALL NEW DUCTS W/ NO ASBESTOS!LIGHT & BRIGHT W/ 2 FRPLS. COMPLETLY FENCED FOR SAFETY. PVT BACK YARD. PROF LANDSCP. OVERSIZED LARGE FINISHED 2+ SUV GARAGE W/ CEILING STORAGE & CEILING EHAUST. NO SIGN UP. TENANTS OCCUPIED IS ONLY REASON FOR LONG LISTING TIME.
http://www.redfin.com/stingray/do/printable-listing?listing-id=849915
Posted by camsavem on 02/15/08 at 09:10 AM
Dude you got to calm down on the bashing.
It has been related to you previously that you cannot compare different markets. This is a nice home in a good location at a decent price per square foot. The realtor did a horrible job of displaying the home and took bad pictures.
I guess with it being a short sale and a cheap price, they are assuming it will sell regardless. We all agree, price is everything right now.
Personally my wife and I are looking for a home like this in that it is somewhat generic and can be individualized to your own personal taste with minimal investment.
This is the best “deal” I have seen in Irvine to date…..
Posted by former_irvine_resident on 02/15/08 at 09:15 AM
Excellent observation jhill and for those of us who have followed IR’s blog longer we have certainly seen some doozies. I particularly liked the sideways pictures from just a few days ago - that was a classic!
We have had a good time laughing at Realtards pathetic attempts to market these ‘special’ Irvine homes. Does anyone have some favorites they’d like to share?
I know when I purchased in 2001 near the beginning of the run up, it was amazing to me the poor quality condition of many homes I toured. I think that many of todays newer Realtards simply don’t get it. During the bubble they literally did nothing to stage homes and they sold. Now it is obviously much more difficult and they either lack the skill or experience to take even the most basic steps in preparing a home.
Posted by ipoplaya on 02/15/08 at 09:22 AM
Wishful thinking by those who don’t understand mortgage markets. Short rates have fallen and will likely fall if the Fed keeps dropping. Long rates seem to be doing nothing but move up… I think 30-year conforming rates have moved up almost half a point since emergency Fed drop and stimulus package announcement.
Jumbos 30-years are at a 4-month high right now. I think many would-be buyers are counting on the conforming loan limit increase. Another .50 to .75 move up in conforming rates, and whatever rate decrease as a result of the stimulus package for formerly jumbo borrowers that would have been will mostly be gone.
Posted by camsavem on 02/15/08 at 09:22 AM
The fed funds rate has NOTHING to do with morgage rates.
Equity lines - yes
Credit Cards - yes
Auto loans - yes
Mortgage - no
Mortgage rates are set off of the 10 year treasury rate.
Posted by 7 on 02/15/08 at 09:24 AM
As mentioned before, the fed funds rate is not tied with the mortgage rate. The fed’s rate can fall to ( negative 5.0%) and the 30 yrs rate can still be 5% or higher. The only one that helped by the fed fund rate is the adjustable rate like credit card, maybe car loan and such, I think. No bank going to lend you hundreds of thousand dollars at a commited rate for 30 yrs. if they need to figure in the inflation and future interest rate.
Posted by IrvineResident on 02/15/08 at 09:43 AM
Most Sellers are still in denial. the number of unsold homes will continue to surge simply because market participants can not bear sellers’ price.
does anyone think this seller really wants a sell?
http://www.redfin.com/stingray/do/printable-listing?listing-id=1419020
20 North Torrey PNE
Irvine, CA 92620
Price: $8,000,000
Buy with Redfin and Save $160,000*
Beds: 3
Baths: 2
Sq. Ft.: 1,765
$/Sq. Ft.: $4,533
Lot Size: 5,000 Sq. Ft.
Type: Single Family Residence
Style: Other
Year Built: 2006
Stories: One Level
Area: West Irvine
County: Orange
MLS#: P618797
Status: Active
On Redfin: 24 days
This seller wants 364% appreciation in less than 9 years?
31 ARBORWOOD, Irvine, CA 92620
List Price: $2,100,000
Last Sale: 07/28/99
Sales Price: $576,500
Bedrooms: 5
Full Baths: 5
Partial Baths: 0
Square Feet: 3,700
Lot Size: 17,000 Sq. Ft.
Year Built: 1999
Listing Date: 02/14/08
On Market: 1 day
Type: SFR
Status: ACTIVE
MLS #: S521726
(sorry not listed on redfin yet)
http://www.ziprealty.com/buy_a_home/logged_in/search/home_detail.jsp?listing_num=S521726&mls=mls_so_cal&cKey=nn76ptqx&source=SOCALMLS
Posted by ipoplaya on 02/15/08 at 09:46 AM
Not true cams. Shorter duration ARMs are not as tied to the 10-year. That is why you will see that 5/1 ARM rates dropped down in January and have stayed mostly down in spite of the recent moves in the 10-year which was pushed up rates on 30-year products… 1 and 3-year ARMs are definitely much more affected by Fed drops.
Posted by Chuck on 02/15/08 at 09:53 AM
The only thing I can think of is he meant to say 180 degree security cameras. But actually wouldn’t you want 360 degree coverage for the front and the back of the house? Who knows.
And yes, this house is asbestos and radiation free! Where do I sign?
Posted by IrvineResident on 02/15/08 at 09:56 AM
I get daily update of newly listed homes from ziprealty. My observation of asking prices is that selles are still in denial. The number of unsold homes will continue to surge in a rapid pace. The market participants can not bear seller WTF price.
Trust your eyes when you see this seller asking price, does anybody suspect the owner wants a sell?
http://www.redfin.com/stingray/do/printable-listing?listing-id=1419020
20 North Torrey PNE
Irvine, CA 92620
Price: $8,000,000
Buy with Redfin and Save $160,000*
Beds: 3
Baths: 2
Sq. Ft.: 1,765
$/Sq. Ft.: $4,533
Lot Size: 5,000 Sq. Ft.
Type: Single Family Residence
Style: Other
Year Built: 2006
Stories: One Level
Area: West Irvine
County: Orange
MLS#: P618797
Status: Active
On Redfin: 24 days
The next seller wants 364% appreciation in less than 9 years for an asset that barely beats inflation.
31 ARBORWOOD, Irvine, CA 92620
List Price: $2,100,000
Last Sale: 07/28/99
Sales Price: $576,500
Bedrooms: 5
Full Baths: 5
Partial Baths: 0
Square Feet: 3,700
Lot Size: 17,000 Sq. Ft.
Year Built: 1999
Listing Date: 02/14/08
On Market: 1 day
Type: SFR
Status: ACTIVE
MLS #: S521726
Posted by IrvineResident on 02/15/08 at 09:57 AM
sorry for the double post
Posted by Chuck on 02/15/08 at 10:00 AM
One word - TYPO. There are no $8 million houses for sale in West Irvine. It must be $800,000. The assessed value is $847,354.
Posted by ipoplaya on 02/15/08 at 10:13 AM
LOL. And the Torrey Pine property is not in West Irvine either… That’s one good realtor there. Torrey Pine is in Northwood II, where there is much on the market and sellers will be going under.
Posted by MMG on 02/15/08 at 10:17 AM
as Nanowest any I have said a few months ago:
200 and below for SqFt, HERE WE COME :mrgreen:
Posted by MMG on 02/15/08 at 10:20 AM
Ipo said:—->Then again, these places lease out for $3800-4000 so why buy it for $850K if one was already renting? It’s gonna fall to $700-750K…
Ipo is becoming one mean bear
Posted by MMG on 02/15/08 at 10:24 AM
to date being the key word :mrgreen:
I have to agree with AZ, this is one McPOS place that will still go down in price due to the fact that >800k is alot of money to pay for a house even in Irvine,
once the market finishs the fall off the cliff, people will think many many times about where to park 170k for down payment and pay 4-5 k per month. it’s all about psychology and mood of buyers.
Posted by skek on 02/15/08 at 10:27 AM
Outstanding find! I like the fact that the home simultaneously has a long term tenant (hence why it hasn’t sold in nearly a year) but it’s available for lease. In my industry, this type of work would get you fired—not a $30k commission. Amazing.
Posted by Andrew on 02/15/08 at 10:37 AM
A Nissan Sentra in the driveway of a supposed million-dollar house? Great sales pitch there.
Posted by ipoplaya on 02/15/08 at 10:41 AM
Arborwood is an insane price. That is more expensive than anything on New Dawn, and the New Dawn tract is in a much better location and nicer IMO. A home not far from this Arborwood place, 5 Roselead also with 5 bedrooms and over 3000sf, went back to the bank in August for $1.15M and sold in November for $1.2M.
Arborwood does have a crazy big and cool lot though. Sucks that it backs to Portola.
Posted by 25w100k+ on 02/15/08 at 10:47 AM
Uh, didn’t you know? AZ lives in a really sweet apartment in the middle of the desert, duh! He would never want to move into a big place like this when he’s living the high life!
Posted by ipoplaya on 02/15/08 at 10:57 AM
I drove by Legacy today on the way to work… The house next to it has a large collection of jallopy (sp?) vehicles. IMO that neighborhood has a pretty high WT look-and-feel going on. The backyard fence, on the frontside of the house has collapsed, i.e. you can see right into the ole backyard. Nice. Little bit of a fixer upper. Appears that people are still living there and there is no realtor sign out front.
Posted by tenmagnet on 02/15/08 at 10:58 AM
Ipop,
As soon as I looked up Arborwood on the map, immediately knew you were going to mention that it backs up to Portola. Funny thing is I never cared about that before but its come up so frequently in your comments and in our discussions that I’m starting to view that as a negative as well. Looked at 46 Logan this morning in Woodbury, like the location and price but was thinking it seems awfully close to Irvine Blvd.
Posted by NanoWest on 02/15/08 at 10:59 AM
MMG,
Yes 200 PSF will be the norm for SFR in Irvine…........condos may sink to 150 PSF.
Agreed.
Posted by Mr Vincent on 02/15/08 at 11:12 AM
Regarding todays property: 5 beds and 4 baths. Would be a good home for a big or multi-gen family. Better put everyone to work to make the payment and pay the taxes etc.
I would pay 550k for it, but its really not my type of place. I like the square footage, but too many beds.
The lot size, location and curb appeal is very good.
Look at the 1998 selling price if you want to see the lunacy that has taken over in America since then.
Posted by Irvinewanabe on 02/15/08 at 11:14 AM
I think the North Torrey price of $8,000,000 must be a typo. The original list price from the Redfin info below is $780,000. My guess is they meant to list for $800,000.
That in itself is an issue. I guess if you can’t sell at the original asking price you should INCREASE the price not lower the price. What a concept! That should really pull those buyers in!!!!
Listing Price Information
List Price High: $8,000,000.00
List Price Low: $8,000,000.00
Original List Price: $780,000.00
Search Price High: $8,000,000.00
Search Price Low: $8,000,000.00
Posted by ipoplaya on 02/15/08 at 11:20 AM
What’s the three most important things in real estate? Location, location, location. Personally, if I am dropping big coin on a house, I don’t want to have a street that rivals highways in most states, just beyond my 6’ wall.
Think about that Valente property. It is way nicer than Parma inside. Same plan I believe, definitely same size. Which one got into escrow? People love that Valente lot, well, at least until they look over the wall…
I use Portola to get from West Irvine over to the Woodbury area more often than not. Drive is nice, green lights all the way usually. I fly by the backyard of Arborwood at 60-65mph. People will say, “oh, with the double-paned windows closed you can barely hear the cars”.
Maybe I am old school, but I want to be able to keep my windows open! I sure as heck don’t want to have to put in a water feature in the backyard just to get some white noise… More often than not, if you see a listing with a fountain in the backyard, that probably means it’s got lots of road noise.
Posted by AZDavidPhx on 02/15/08 at 11:34 AM
camsavem -
“It has been related to you previously that you cannot compare different markets.“
Which post of mine are you referring to? I just said that I didn’t get what the deal was with the narrow hallway and you come at me with this “you can’t compare different markets” salvo.
Posted by tenmagnet on 02/15/08 at 11:38 AM
Yeah, I understand where you’re coming from. Since we’re both looking in to buy in the same market/area, and generally in the same price range, I pay close attention to your comments. Looking at the 46 Logan location today made me think of your location comments. Definitely a positive.
Posted by Silly's Mom on 02/15/08 at 11:38 AM
Either it’s a typo because the original listing price was $780 K and they upped it to 800K and added an extra zero by accident, or it was a ploy to be featured on this blog for the free advertising.
I agree with IPOP on the price on Arborwood - crazy! I love Somerton and had originally hoped to get in over there, but it’ll never happen unless prices drop a LOT more. Which of course, they may!
Posted by AZDavidPhx on 02/15/08 at 11:39 AM
25w100k+
The ego is larger than the bank account!
Posted by Silly's Mom on 02/15/08 at 11:39 AM
Somehow I didn’t see the above comment making the same point as me… sorry!
Posted by AZDavidPhx on 02/15/08 at 11:44 AM
People on ebay put more effort into describing a piece of toast shaped like Jesus than these people put into describing a million dollar house.
Good call!
Posted by 4walls4me on 02/15/08 at 11:49 AM
If this is a flip/investment property, then the loan is a recourse one, right?
Doesn’t that mean the bank can take whatever $$ this flipper has from previous flips? Don’t they get to go after his assets in this case?
Posted by Silly's Mom on 02/15/08 at 11:50 AM
You know they say “3 kids is the new 2” so if you want to have a guest room (or a room for Grandma) and a room for the 3 kids, then you need 5 bedrooms. Of course, in a recession (oops, I used the R word) people will probably choose to have fewer children.
Posted by tenmagnet on 02/15/08 at 11:58 AM
Personally, I prefer Rosegate over Somerton but at this point agree with you about the need for substantially price declines before we can all get in either one.
Posted by Silly's Mom on 02/15/08 at 11:58 AM
Hey IPOP - new this week 41 New Dawn, listed for a whopping $2,299,000! Those Rosegate people must get the koolaid piped in by the IRWD.
Posted by former_irvine_resident on 02/15/08 at 11:59 AM
I learned that lesson when I sold my first home… Or rather I should say, tried to sell my first home. I needed to find the best deal I could since I was still in college (grad school) so I ended up buying next to a cement plant and a landfill. Needless to say it took a while to sell the place.
When I bought in Irvine I took my time to find a place that had a good location, location, and location. Close to schools, easy access to major roads but not right on one, and in a cul-de-sac. It was pretty easy to sell in Sep06 when I needed to leave. I priced a bit below market and it was out of my hands in less than a month.
There is truly something to be said for location, location, location!
Posted by tenmagnet on 02/15/08 at 12:09 PM
OMG! Haven’t seen this one before, probably because of the hefty $$$ price tag.
This will certainly not help me with the seller of 1 New Dawn.
I’ve been trying to talk this guy down to no avail these past few months. No wonder, the koolaide must be flowing freely over there.
Posted by rkp on 02/15/08 at 12:15 PM
We always wonder what the owners were thinking. How about if IHB adds a new feature where they actually interview the owners. Imagine how much more interesting these posts will be if we knew what the owner was thinking!
What do you say IR? A simple way to start would be an email based interview.
Posted by momopi on 02/15/08 at 12:17 PM
For whatever the reason, this house doesn’t really give me good vibes. It just feels “wrong” somehow. I would not want to buy or live there, and it has nothing to do with the price per sq ft.
Posted by Silly's Mom on 02/15/08 at 12:23 PM
Tenmagnet: I like Rosegate too, but I think 4200 square feet is just too much house for me to take care of. Somerton is approx. 3300-3700 (I think) and that sounds much more reasonable for me personally. I also think that Rosegate has dated looking exterior color schemes - lots of white and cream. But that’s just me! Good luck with the 1 New Dawn. He’s probably thrilled with this new listing, because suddenly his house looks like the bargain in the tract!
Posted by Rocker on 02/15/08 at 12:23 PM
Yikes!
An acquaintance bought a similar property close to this house in fall of 2005 for $1M, this was their 3rd house in 3 years!, a serial upgrader case, their previous trades were successful because the bull market, but if they sell today (or are forced to sell) they will lose their down payment which probably included all equity gained in their previous trades, they had this big assumption about Irvine RE going up, up an up.
The lesson here is, same as stocks, you need to diversify!, it was wrong to rollover all the previous equity gained into another house.
Posted by NoWow!way on 02/15/08 at 12:39 PM
People will say, “oh, with the double-paned windows closed you can barely hear the cars”.
And no one should underestimate the grime and grit from a high traffic area. I’ve lived close to busy streets. You can tune out the noise, but that gross air quality from traffic lands in your home and you can feel and see it when you wipe and dust. And you’ll do that a lot more often, too
Posted by ipoplaya on 02/15/08 at 12:46 PM
Hey ten, you watch Northpark too right? Just saw the closing price on 8 Pacific Grove, which is 2830sf, just like the Sunnyvale place that closed a few months back. Sold for $1.025M and closed yesterday. It actually went for MORE than the previous comp of the same exact model…
Pacific Grove did have quite a bit sunk in landscaping though, so the price in real terms was probably a bit less than the recent Sunnyvale close.
Posted by ipoplaya on 02/15/08 at 12:49 PM
http://www.zillow.com/HomeDetails.htm?zprop=51633190
Posted by tenmagnet on 02/15/08 at 12:50 PM
Enjoyed reading your comments; you bring up some very good points. The fact that these sellers aren’t coming down is very discouraging. What do you think about the two on Woodhaven Lane?
Posted by HAPPYHEART on 02/15/08 at 12:52 PM
We sold our home last year after having it on the market for 13 months. I used an older gentleman realtor who was quite high up in the NAR organization. The main picture of our house on the MLS prominently displayed his steel yard (pounded into the front lawn). The pictures of the backyard were taken from inside the house through a window. Then, to further have potential buyers licking their chops he added verbage like “wall to wall” carpet, and “built in 1977” and “fresh paint”. The house had four bedrooms, however we used the forth bedroom as an office, but I had to fight him to list as a 4 bedroom house. He insisted it was only 3 because we had built-ins the office. He was a nice guy, and I didn’t want to dump him, so I rewrote the listing myself and took out 90% of his lines. I actually used language that would entice a buyer to want to look at the house, which was beautifully remodeled with granite and custom travertine floors etc. Who the hell would WANT to look at a house built in 1977??? I also had to force him to replace his pictures with better shots. I’m still kicking myself for paying a 5% commission when I did everything but draw up the escrow papers.
Posted by Peter on 02/15/08 at 01:01 PM
Never moved in???
Posted by tenmagnet on 02/15/08 at 01:25 PM
Thanks for the info and the link. 8 Pacific Grove looks nice; personally I like it better than the two on Sunnyvale. 18 Sunnyvale, which is listed on your site (great site, btw) is already in escrow. It will be interesting to see where that one closes. Along with 8 Pacific Grove it will certainly impact the pricing of 16 Sunnyvale, which still remains on the market.
Are you thinking of making a run at 16 Sunnyvale?
Posted by CapitalismWorks on 02/15/08 at 01:37 PM
The best bet would be to follow up on closed sales. I can’t imagine a home owner in the process of selling have much interest in tipping their hand.
Posted by ipoplaya on 02/15/08 at 01:38 PM
16 SV is the exact same home as 8 PG, just not as nice. I think 16 SV is probably worth around $975Kish based on the 8 PG comp.
We made a run at 12 Sunnyvale, also this same model, but couldn’t get them to go under $1M. It closed in December for just a smidge above $1M.
I like the interior layout of this plan. Big great room. Dining and small living are not contiguous. Big loft area at the top of the stairs. Bedrooms are decent sized as well. Downstairs bedroom is teeny tiny though. Can’t really double as an office and guest bedroom IMO. Perfect for an office if your guests will pull up a floatie in the loft…
Posted by CapitalismWorks on 02/15/08 at 01:41 PM
Some Positive news out of Detroit (from Drudgereport).
http://www.detnews.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080215/BIZ/802150373
Posted by ipoplaya on 02/15/08 at 01:42 PM
22 Malibu is smoking big crack:
http://www.redfin.com/stingray/do/printable-listing?listing-id=1476793
Trying to get $100K more than 2006 purchase? Good luck. Malibu could be the next big REO in NP…
Posted by Genius on 02/15/08 at 01:48 PM
“It has been related to you previously that you cannot compare different markets.“
Because real estate is local, right? RIGHT?
“Irvine is different.“
Posted by rkp on 02/15/08 at 01:55 PM
Well if its a short sale, there isn’t much to tip their hands. Though I agree it would be hard to convince a seller to share anything. There isn’t any benefit for them.
Posted by Genius on 02/15/08 at 02:09 PM
To paraphrase from something you wrote the other day, the whole state should be free. All of the transplants I know from Michigan are very happy to be out.
Posted by tenmagnet on 02/15/08 at 02:13 PM
Yeah, I agree 22 Malibu is completely un-realistic, not to mention 6 Malibu has more appeal and is priced significantly lower. Nonetheless, I wouldn’t mind seeing either of these breach the $1M mark.
Posted by Kirk on 02/15/08 at 02:56 PM
AZDavidPhx,
It makes sense that you would make such an ignorant comment since you are from the state with the most liberal senator in the United States. It is the Virgin Mary that chooses to signal blessings by appearing in silhouette on various food items. Not Christ. Don’t think that I didn’t pick up on the anti-Christian undertone of your statement. I think it shows cowardice when people choose to speak in code against the only people capable of love.
What exactly is it that you have against Christian Americans anyway? I mean, I could understand that every so often a person might make an off color comment or two, but ever since I’ve visited this blog I’ve noticed that you have never once mentioned how great this country is nor have you ever condemned the actions of Islamofascist terrorists.
I pray nightly for people like you. I pray that our Lord shows you that you are wrong to live such a resentful existence. I pray that He gently explains why you are going to burn for your sins just before you are licked by the flames of eternal damnation. Unlike you, I have compassion for my fellow man.
Posted by Purplehaze on 02/15/08 at 04:24 PM
Hey Kirk,
Why the white supremacist christian dialogue? Why the claim on christians being the only religion in the world capable of love? Any exclusivist claim is pure BS. There were many religiions before christianity even came into the picture. If those religions are not claiming superiority, you should at least be humble enough and admit that there are other paths to god.
Peace out!
Posted by lendingmaestro on 02/15/08 at 04:52 PM
Why are security cameras need in Newport Beach? Was this house used as a meth lab?
Posted by lendingmaestro on 02/15/08 at 04:59 PM
Dude, WTF, is this a joke? That $8 mil price tag has to be a joke or misprint, It has to!
If you told me that the moon was actually a secret alien space station which has been spying on us for a few millennia, I’d believe it before that home’s price.
Posted by Kirk on 02/15/08 at 07:22 PM
Purplehaze,
We have a word for the vitriol you have thrown my way: blasphemy.
Love comes from God’s love and if you’d ever bother to read the Bible you would know that God only loves those who worship His Son. There’s no point in you reading it now though, because Jesus teaches that once a sin has been committed there can be no forgiveness. I’m sorry you weren’t taught this early enough.
Posted by ex-tangelo on 02/15/08 at 08:24 PM
Wait, the what? People put kids in separate bedrooms?
I’ve got the kids piled up in one bedroom like cordwood. Get used to it, kiddos, and college dorms will feel spacious! Bwahahahaha
...
(Don’t ask me about the Mini Cooper with two child seats in the back, either. And by the way, I’m six feet tall)
Posted by Trooper on 02/15/08 at 08:28 PM
Jesus wasn’t in the toast, silly ! It was a grilled cheese sandwich.
http://www.mrbreakfast.com/article.asp?articleid=23
Posted by ex-tangelo on 02/15/08 at 08:30 PM
It’s also brake dust and rubber dust. At least they don’t use asbestos brake linings anymore. But that rubber is no good for your lungs.
Our house is 250 feet from a 4-lane lightly-traveled expressway, and we get black dust on horizontal surfaces outside. And there isn’t nearly the traffic volume on that as you get from any of those big Irvine arterials like Barranca or Irvine Ctr Drive or whatever…
Posted by ex-tangelo on 02/15/08 at 08:59 PM
Silly’s Mom: At least it has NO ASBESTOS! Wow, that’s a real selling point for me.
btw, California’s state rock is “Serpentinite”
Serpentinite can contain chrysotile, the serpentine mineral that crystallizes in long, thin fibers. This is the mineral commonly known as asbestos.
*California* contains asbestos…
Posted by George8 on 02/15/08 at 09:35 PM
Sold to IPO, $850K. I think it is a decent buy if you can have good use of it.
Posted by Lost Cause on 02/15/08 at 10:05 PM
Of course, the best memories of Irvine come from the Grateful Dead at Irvine Meadows. Two alien worlds collide.
Posted by Lost Cause on 02/15/08 at 10:08 PM
There is also lead that persists along heavily travelled older roads, from the decades of leaded gasoline.
Posted by AZDavidPhx on 02/16/08 at 04:21 AM
That’s an awful lot to read into my post there, Kirk.
Thanks for your prayers though. That gave me an idea -
We should start a housing prayer group. With a little help from above, we might be able to pray house prices back down into normalcy.
Posted by cyberpunk on 02/16/08 at 04:59 AM
KirkTroll, please go back under your rock and come out when you can be on-topic.
Posted by cyberpunk on 02/16/08 at 05:29 AM
You’re not joking, I have two adjoining neighbors with five people in each two bedroom apartment! That’s two adults with three kids in each two bedroom apartment! They must hate me for taking up a whole two bed apartment by myself! LOL